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Posted on: 09/12/14 08:05PM
Well, looks like my last two post didn't go through because I got logged out. But let me show you this. I was looking up the legality of loli on the internet (America) and there are a couple of cases where people have gotten in trouble for it.
Just wanted to show you guys this. This is from Wikipedia.
2012 Missouri case
In October 2012, after being reported August 2011 by his wife, a 36 year old man named Christian Bee in Monett, Missouri entered a plea bargain to "possession of cartoons depicting child pornography", with the US attorney's office for the Western District of Missouri recommending a 3 year prison sentence without parole. The office in conjunction with the Southwest Missouri Cyber Crimes Task Force argued that the "Incest Comics" on Bee's computer "clearly lack any literary, artistic, political or scientific value"
This is why I really don't want to be ambushed by this stuff! There are people in America that will dedicate their lives to come after you, if they even "think" you had something to do with it.
And it looks like the EU and Japan are also passing harsh laws against cartoon "loli". Its dangerous to have this stuff on your board.
Just sayin.
Just wanted to show you guys this. This is from Wikipedia.
2012 Missouri case
In October 2012, after being reported August 2011 by his wife, a 36 year old man named Christian Bee in Monett, Missouri entered a plea bargain to "possession of cartoons depicting child pornography", with the US attorney's office for the Western District of Missouri recommending a 3 year prison sentence without parole. The office in conjunction with the Southwest Missouri Cyber Crimes Task Force argued that the "Incest Comics" on Bee's computer "clearly lack any literary, artistic, political or scientific value"
This is why I really don't want to be ambushed by this stuff! There are people in America that will dedicate their lives to come after you, if they even "think" you had something to do with it.
And it looks like the EU and Japan are also passing harsh laws against cartoon "loli". Its dangerous to have this stuff on your board.
Just sayin.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:09PM
frito61 said:
I'm talking about pics where the character looks like they're 8 or 10. You know, a KID. Or, the ones I really hate, where they stick a child's face /head (and I mean a child!) on an older looking body. Creepy! Maybe there should be a tag for that.
I'm talking about pics where the character looks like they're 8 or 10. You know, a KID. Or, the ones I really hate, where they stick a child's face /head (and I mean a child!) on an older looking body. Creepy! Maybe there should be a tag for that.
...So, "anime", right?
Seriously, I don't mean to be rude, but most of the linked examples here don't look remotely "loli". You can try blacklisting additional tags that might rule out the kind of stuff that's bothering you - "school_uniform", "flat_chest", etc, but you're having really strong reactions to very common artistic styles in anime/manga. That kind of thing comes pretty much part-and-parcel for hentai and it's not going away anytime soon. I'd suggest a more comprehensive blacklist than just "loli", or, if it's upsetting you to the point of "nightmares", then for your own sake finding a site that's more to your taste.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:15PM
You obviously didn't read my other posts. School uniform and flat chest are not what I'm talking about. I mean 8 year olds having sex.
And if you want to question my blacklist...
loli pan lolicon gay yaoi orange_bullet scat piss peeing tanis_mummy winnie_werewolf ruby_gloom_(character) ruby_gloom poo fat gross inspector_gadget vore solo_male pregnant prego futanari futa weird transgender geriatric granny ikkyuu aobii_dou yowesephth baby baby_fuck toddler kthblk toddlercon doomcomic shota shotacon straight_shota mikereaper mikereaper_(artist) girlycard schrodinger watersports guro oppai_loli muscles muscle bobblk beastiality yozora powerpuff_girls lucky_star bart_simpson jessica_lovejoy maggie_simpson kadota_kyouhei orihara_izaya lisa_simpson zia_simpson lisa_jr thegalen_(artist) trent_reznor pee curby bestiality dee_dee deedee dexters_laboratory shippo's_game card_captor_sakura azumanga_daioh lolilike megabondagemon hoshino_ruri narutaru user:zodiaco-001 codpiece_(artist) theedministrator765_(artist) jones316 powerpuff_girls_z atomic_betty buttercup blossom bubbles flim_flam rascalraccoon special_k lilo mandy penny lilo_and_stitch amberfan 101_dalmatians toonpimp majin_buu burter jeice ginyu_force flora's_daughter bianca's_daughter debora's_daughter kanade_tachibana mitsudo_moe jane_and_the_dragon ia ymir roll lolita_channel strike_witches gunslinger_girl shippo sailor_saturn a_pup_named_scooby-doo loli-ish chibi_usa chibi diapers hotaru_tomoe melvin goo_goo_gaga boy_rape femdom genderswap farang_ding_dong chubby ururu_tsumugiya edward_wong_hau_pepelu_tivrusky_iv ed toadette sasami_masaki_jurai magical_girl_pretty_sammy mystroh toot_braunstein rabu_rabu_wedingu! rule_63 questionable isabella_garcia isabella_garcia-shapiro gideon amputation amputee child_porn fu_(counting01) fireside_girls zimmerman aioi_yuuko gee_wiz lolico rin to_aru_kagaku_no_railgun to_aru_majutsu_no_index digimon fisting my_little_pony angel_wish yachiru penny_gadget suzumiya_haruhi_no_yuuutsu hikari_(pokemon) hikari errorless_(artist) phantasma_phantom professor_layton ugly
Anyone who doesn't like underage feel free to copy it. Though it won't do you much good. There are just waayyyyyy to many shows out there I don't know about. Correct tagging is the only thing that really works and unfortunately, the loli uploaders don't seem to want to do it.
And if you want to question my blacklist...
loli pan lolicon gay yaoi orange_bullet scat piss peeing tanis_mummy winnie_werewolf ruby_gloom_(character) ruby_gloom poo fat gross inspector_gadget vore solo_male pregnant prego futanari futa weird transgender geriatric granny ikkyuu aobii_dou yowesephth baby baby_fuck toddler kthblk toddlercon doomcomic shota shotacon straight_shota mikereaper mikereaper_(artist) girlycard schrodinger watersports guro oppai_loli muscles muscle bobblk beastiality yozora powerpuff_girls lucky_star bart_simpson jessica_lovejoy maggie_simpson kadota_kyouhei orihara_izaya lisa_simpson zia_simpson lisa_jr thegalen_(artist) trent_reznor pee curby bestiality dee_dee deedee dexters_laboratory shippo's_game card_captor_sakura azumanga_daioh lolilike megabondagemon hoshino_ruri narutaru user:zodiaco-001 codpiece_(artist) theedministrator765_(artist) jones316 powerpuff_girls_z atomic_betty buttercup blossom bubbles flim_flam rascalraccoon special_k lilo mandy penny lilo_and_stitch amberfan 101_dalmatians toonpimp majin_buu burter jeice ginyu_force flora's_daughter bianca's_daughter debora's_daughter kanade_tachibana mitsudo_moe jane_and_the_dragon ia ymir roll lolita_channel strike_witches gunslinger_girl shippo sailor_saturn a_pup_named_scooby-doo loli-ish chibi_usa chibi diapers hotaru_tomoe melvin goo_goo_gaga boy_rape femdom genderswap farang_ding_dong chubby ururu_tsumugiya edward_wong_hau_pepelu_tivrusky_iv ed toadette sasami_masaki_jurai magical_girl_pretty_sammy mystroh toot_braunstein rabu_rabu_wedingu! rule_63 questionable isabella_garcia isabella_garcia-shapiro gideon amputation amputee child_porn fu_(counting01) fireside_girls zimmerman aioi_yuuko gee_wiz lolico rin to_aru_kagaku_no_railgun to_aru_majutsu_no_index digimon fisting my_little_pony angel_wish yachiru penny_gadget suzumiya_haruhi_no_yuuutsu hikari_(pokemon) hikari errorless_(artist) phantasma_phantom professor_layton ugly
Anyone who doesn't like underage feel free to copy it. Though it won't do you much good. There are just waayyyyyy to many shows out there I don't know about. Correct tagging is the only thing that really works and unfortunately, the loli uploaders don't seem to want to do it.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:29PM
And yet your tag history includes pictures like these:
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=2316787
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=1983968 (I'm guessing you're the one who tried coining "lolilike" on this one?)
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=1984210
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=1532631
all of whom have bodies clearly developed past pre-pubescence - not loli, by your own definition, nor by many other people. In any case, there's nothing wrong with being grossed out by a picture, but you're expecting people to cater to your own tastes by having things tagged according to your own boundaries.
EDIT: ...Dude, I was offering help, there's no need to react so defensively about me "questioning" your blacklist.
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=2316787
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=1983968 (I'm guessing you're the one who tried coining "lolilike" on this one?)
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=1984210
gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=1532631
all of whom have bodies clearly developed past pre-pubescence - not loli, by your own definition, nor by many other people. In any case, there's nothing wrong with being grossed out by a picture, but you're expecting people to cater to your own tastes by having things tagged according to your own boundaries.
EDIT: ...Dude, I was offering help, there's no need to react so defensively about me "questioning" your blacklist.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:42PM
@ frito61 : I'd like to start by asking you to please use the edit button on your post instead of posting multiple times in a row.
That said, for rating:safe posts the tag that replaces loli is "child".
About that law: It was changed by congress/supreme court at least 6 times since Bush. It was the EU that pushed us into having such a law in the first place. In the 1970's few people cared and before the 1930's it was fully legal and not too uncommon. In fact, sex with minors was only made illegal because under-age prostitutes weren't paying their taxes. Passing laws that restrict what citizens of the US can do (at the federal level) was something new the progressives where starting at the time. (Like prohibition.)
And as for that criminal in Missouri: The punishment was only recommended, what they really got him for was having real cp on his computer. I think he got 12 years for that.
As for 99.99999%, In the Gel community (a skewed pov to be sure) 3.5% are into yaoi/yuri and 4.5% are into loli/shota. If we consider 2.0% of the real community are gay/lesbian than that's still around 3.0% of people who are into [strike]under-age[/strike] pre-pubesent relations, even if those relations are only fictional. At the very least, this fictional world can act as an outlet to those with such desires so perhaps they won't/are less likely to act out on these desires in the real world. This is yet another reason why Gel/Dan will likely still allow such art in the foreseeable future.
Note: 2 more posts where made while I was writing this.
That said, for rating:safe posts the tag that replaces loli is "child".
About that law: It was changed by congress/supreme court at least 6 times since Bush. It was the EU that pushed us into having such a law in the first place. In the 1970's few people cared and before the 1930's it was fully legal and not too uncommon. In fact, sex with minors was only made illegal because under-age prostitutes weren't paying their taxes. Passing laws that restrict what citizens of the US can do (at the federal level) was something new the progressives where starting at the time. (Like prohibition.)
And as for that criminal in Missouri: The punishment was only recommended, what they really got him for was having real cp on his computer. I think he got 12 years for that.
As for 99.99999%, In the Gel community (a skewed pov to be sure) 3.5% are into yaoi/yuri and 4.5% are into loli/shota. If we consider 2.0% of the real community are gay/lesbian than that's still around 3.0% of people who are into [strike]under-age[/strike] pre-pubesent relations, even if those relations are only fictional. At the very least, this fictional world can act as an outlet to those with such desires so perhaps they won't/are less likely to act out on these desires in the real world. This is yet another reason why Gel/Dan will likely still allow such art in the foreseeable future.
Note: 2 more posts where made while I was writing this.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:46PM
Being ambushed by bad pics you were trying to blacklist is very unpleasant. I can forgive a few that are borderline, but most are obvious what they are. But far more than that, my posts are about the "illegality" of the material in most countries, and above all, uploaders not tagging the main theme of the pic. Hey, if she's 8, please tag it "loli". Then you won't have upset people. I've seen posts ranting about how much the user hates bondage, and why don't people tag it? So, as a guy who likes bondage, I do when I see it not carrying the "bondage" or "bdsm" tag. 1). It lets those who don't like bondage blacklist that pics ( and not be shocked ) and 2) it gives me a filter to show only bondage pics. Win/Win.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:52PM
frito61 said:
Being ambushed by bad pics you were trying to blacklist is very unpleasant. I can forgive a few that are borderline, but most are obvious what they are. But far more than that, my posts are about the "illegality" of the material in most countries, and above all, uploaders not tagging the main theme of the pic. Hey, if she's 8, please tag it "loli". Then you won't have upset people. I've seen posts ranting about how much the user hates bondage, and why don't people tag it? So, as a guy who likes bondage, I do when I see it not carrying the "bondage" or "bdsm" tag. 1). It lets those who don't like bondage blacklist that pics ( and not be shocked ) and 2) it gives me a filter to show only bondage pics. Win/Win.
Being ambushed by bad pics you were trying to blacklist is very unpleasant. I can forgive a few that are borderline, but most are obvious what they are. But far more than that, my posts are about the "illegality" of the material in most countries, and above all, uploaders not tagging the main theme of the pic. Hey, if she's 8, please tag it "loli". Then you won't have upset people. I've seen posts ranting about how much the user hates bondage, and why don't people tag it? So, as a guy who likes bondage, I do when I see it not carrying the "bondage" or "bdsm" tag. 1). It lets those who don't like bondage blacklist that pics ( and not be shocked ) and 2) it gives me a filter to show only bondage pics. Win/Win.
That's the case yes but it's not the argument because you're right. The problem is that tags are mostly added by ordinary users or bots. As a mod, I can fix things I come across but it's hard to start a project like this and expect to finish any time soon. I've tried such things before and failed miserably. Luckily, my time on the net has made me numb to anything they can throw at me so it's not a problem for me to look at such pics from time to time and fix them. (I'm talking about everything, not just loli/shota, bdsm etc.)
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:55PM
I did a quick search through "bondage -loli -shota -straight_shota" and only found a handful of images after about 5 pages that qualified for the applicable tags. While writing this post I also went through pages 1-5 again as well as 6-11 with similar results. This is certainly a problem, but not the epidemic you're making it out to be.
We weren't asking you to fix the tagging on these posts. Just to let us know which ones they are so we can let the user know that they need to properly tag their posts. We currently have a staff of less than 20 active moderators, which gives us way less coverage than would allow us to keep a continuous eye on individual tags to watch for this kind of discrepancy. In general, most posts featuring loli characters do tend to have the tag. After all, it's the most searched for tag on the site (I have no idea where Jedi was getting his numbers from), and uploaders want people to find their images. It's also an easy tag to include to meet the 5-tag minimum requirement for uploading. In a sea of loli images which are properly tagged as loli, it's really difficult for us to pick out the ones which are not considering that most of us do not use a blacklist and have no way of knowing which ones are not properly tagged outside of performing very specific searches. With over 2.2 million images to moderate, this is incredibly infeasible. Because of this, we largely have to rely on users to help us spot these types of activity.
Finally, please edit your posts instead of double- (or quadruple-) posting.
We weren't asking you to fix the tagging on these posts. Just to let us know which ones they are so we can let the user know that they need to properly tag their posts. We currently have a staff of less than 20 active moderators, which gives us way less coverage than would allow us to keep a continuous eye on individual tags to watch for this kind of discrepancy. In general, most posts featuring loli characters do tend to have the tag. After all, it's the most searched for tag on the site (I have no idea where Jedi was getting his numbers from), and uploaders want people to find their images. It's also an easy tag to include to meet the 5-tag minimum requirement for uploading. In a sea of loli images which are properly tagged as loli, it's really difficult for us to pick out the ones which are not considering that most of us do not use a blacklist and have no way of knowing which ones are not properly tagged outside of performing very specific searches. With over 2.2 million images to moderate, this is incredibly infeasible. Because of this, we largely have to rely on users to help us spot these types of activity.
Finally, please edit your posts instead of double- (or quadruple-) posting.
Posted on: 09/12/14 08:55PM
jedi1357 said:
As for 99.99999%, In the Gel community (a skewed pov to be sure) 3.5% are into yaoi/yuri and 4.5% are into loli/shota. If we consider 2.0% of the real community are gay/lesbian than that's still around 3.0% of people who are into [strike]under-age[/strike] pre-pubesent relations, even if those relations are only fictional. At the very least, this fictional world can act as an outlet to those with such desires so perhaps they won't/are less likely to act out on these desires in the real world. This is yet another reason why Gel/Dan will likely still allow such art in the foreseeable future.
As for 99.99999%, In the Gel community (a skewed pov to be sure) 3.5% are into yaoi/yuri and 4.5% are into loli/shota. If we consider 2.0% of the real community are gay/lesbian than that's still around 3.0% of people who are into [strike]under-age[/strike] pre-pubesent relations, even if those relations are only fictional. At the very least, this fictional world can act as an outlet to those with such desires so perhaps they won't/are less likely to act out on these desires in the real world. This is yet another reason why Gel/Dan will likely still allow such art in the foreseeable future.
Yeah, and I really don't want to rain on anyone's parade. Just PLEASE mark the loli pics for the majority of us who REALLY DON'T want to see that shit. And I do fear laws in America. Its getting where prosecutors and judges are starting to do just whatever they feel like, state by state. Everything is kind of murky now. I'll give you an example of the trouble a friend of mine got into. A prosecutor in our area decided we wanted to please certain political groups. So, when my friend was moving to a new apartment, he had a few bowie knives he had collected. Perfectly legal inside your home. But when he was moving, he had to transport them to his new apartment. Well, he was stopped while moving by a cop who was in league with this prosecutor and ended up in jail for possessing a bowie knife in public. He was in luck. The local Sheriff absolutely hated the prosecutor and stepped in threatening an investigation if the man was prosecuted. All charges ended up being droppped. But if it hadn't been for the sheriff, there's a good chance my friend could have gone to jail. There are some things in America prosecutors absolutely droool about going after. Anything with sex is usually one of them. Weapons would be the next. And I can just imagine how they feel about cartoon loli. Its very scary here in America.
Oh, and sorry about the multiple posts!
And Jerl, maybe it is ignored in your area, but when pics come up on the screen in a search, that means the thumbnails have been downloaded to the computer looking at the page. So, actually, the thumbnails are being transferred. Never know what sticks in your computer. And the cops just LOVE to comb through hard drives now, even deleted stuff. I really just want NOTHING to do with loli.
Posted on: 09/12/14 09:01PM
frito61 said:
Being ambushed by bad pics you were trying to blacklist is very unpleasant. I can forgive a few that are borderline, but most are obvious what they are. But far more than that, my posts are about the "illegality" of the material in most countries, and above all, uploaders not tagging the main theme of the pic. Hey, if she's 8, please tag it "loli". Then you won't have upset people. I've seen posts ranting about how much the user hates bondage, and why don't people tag it? So, as a guy who likes bondage, I do when I see it not carrying the "bondage" or "bdsm" tag. 1). It lets those who don't like bondage blacklist that pics ( and not be shocked ) and 2) it gives me a filter to show only bondage pics. Win/Win.
Being ambushed by bad pics you were trying to blacklist is very unpleasant. I can forgive a few that are borderline, but most are obvious what they are. But far more than that, my posts are about the "illegality" of the material in most countries, and above all, uploaders not tagging the main theme of the pic. Hey, if she's 8, please tag it "loli". Then you won't have upset people. I've seen posts ranting about how much the user hates bondage, and why don't people tag it? So, as a guy who likes bondage, I do when I see it not carrying the "bondage" or "bdsm" tag. 1). It lets those who don't like bondage blacklist that pics ( and not be shocked ) and 2) it gives me a filter to show only bondage pics. Win/Win.
a) Leave worrying about the legality of Gelbooru to the admins. They have more to lose than you or me on this, and given that they already allow loli, I don't think you'll be changing their minds.
b) You're browsing a tag, and something that isn't tagged with something you've blacklisted pops up. Shit happens.
c) Your own interpretation of a character being "loli" is a lot more sensitive than most; if you tagged gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=2316787 as loli then I think at this point it's your problem, not anyone else's.
EDIT:
frito61 said:
And Jerl, maybe it is ignored in your area, but when pics come up on the screen in a search, that means the thumbnails have been downloaded to the computer looking at the page. So, actually, the thumbnails are being transferred. Never know what sticks in your computer. And the cops just LOVE to comb through hard drives now, even deleted stuff. I really just want NOTHING to do with loli.
And Jerl, maybe it is ignored in your area, but when pics come up on the screen in a search, that means the thumbnails have been downloaded to the computer looking at the page. So, actually, the thumbnails are being transferred. Never know what sticks in your computer. And the cops just LOVE to comb through hard drives now, even deleted stuff. I really just want NOTHING to do with loli.
If it's that much of a concern to you, literally the only thing you can do is leave Gelbooru for a site where loli is not allowed at all.
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